Tuesday Political Stuff
Posted April 29th, 2008 by Da King
I'm sick of the Rev. Jeremiah Wright being all over the news. The racist old fool has already gotten far more air time than he deserves, so I'm not going to bother getting into Wright's latest rounds of silliness and nonsense with Bill "Neville" Moyers and the National Press Club. Hatemongers shouldn't get this much free publicity. Hatemongers shouldn't be treated as if they have legitimacy.
Instead, I'll just ask a simple question.
If John McCain attended the Rev. David Duke's church for 20 years, and Timothy McVeigh hosted a fundraiser for McCain at McVeigh's house (assuming McVeigh hadn't already taken the down elevator to his special place in hell), would anybody vote for John McCain ?
Not a chance.
So, why are people still voting for Barack Obama ?
As Obama himself has said repeatedly, judgement counts. Indeed, judgement is paramount. Obama has displayed very poor judgement.
====
The Supreme Court upheld the constitutionality of voter id law in Indiana by a vote of 6-3 (I can't imagine what those 3 justices in the minority were thinking). Of course voter id law is constitutional. This one wasn't even a close call for the Supremes. Republicans applauded the decision, saying it will reduce voter fraud, while Democrats said it squelches their long and storied history of voter fraud keeps the poor and elderly from voting.
In a related story, Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg said the requirement to buy rods, reels, and bait places an undue burden on the people when it comes to fishing. Justice David Souter enthusiastically agreed, adding that the requirement for oars also places on undue burden on rowboaters. The ACLU is expected to bring lawsuits against fishing and boating manufacturers shortly. "It's an issue of social justice," added candidate Barack Obama.
Alright, maybe I made that last paragraph up, but it still sounds about right to me.
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Speaking of the Supreme Court and "social justice," get a load of Obama's qualification list for appointing justices to the Court:
Obama opined that deciding the "truly difficult" cases requires resort to "one's deepest values, one's core concerns, one's broader perspectives on how the world works, and the depth and breadth of one's empathy." In short, "the critical ingredient is supplied by what is in the judge's heart.
Obama has explicitly declared: "We need somebody who's got the heart, the empathy, to recognize what it's like to be a young teenage mom, the empathy to understand what it's like to be poor or African-American or gay or disabled or old–and that's the criterion by which I'll be selecting my judges."
As the Weekly Standard so very correctly observed, you couldn't have a broader call for lawless judicial activism than what Obama has just described there. The Supreme Court is supposed to be a dispassionate interpreter of the U.S. Constitution. Obama openly seeks to turn the Court into a political instrument of social justice. Heaven help us if this man becomes president.
April 29th, 2008 at 9:38 am
I agree with King when he writes about the futile attempt of the liberal media to sanitize the raving bigot, Rev. Wright: “Hatemongers [like Wright] shouldn't get this much free publicity. Hatemonger shouldn't be treated as if they have legitimacy.”
But there’s a silver lining here, King.
True, the liberals — to so called ‘journalists at the National Press club — made complete fools of themselves applauding this anti-white bigot. But the fact still remains, the more exposure Wright gets, the more people will see B. Hussein Obama for what he is.
The liberal reaction to Wright also also reaffirm's people's opinion of just how disconnected the Left is from the real America.
Let this Wright keep bellowing out his hate for America, and let the libs in the media keep rationalizing it away. This will not sway the opinion of normal people that Obama’s closest associates hate America and therefore that at some level, BO must also.
So rave on Wright; let the America see the hate and ignorance in you. Having you on the news only helps defeat the Dims in November. The more the better.
+++++
Regardibng the Supreme Court's decision on Indiana's voter ID law:
This has the Dims squaling like stuck pigs. Why? Because the Dims don't consider elections 'fair' unless they can cheat in them.
In many Dim areas, the Dims count on getting get votes from the dead and illegal aliens.
April 29th, 2008 at 10:51 am
What a shame. It seems that the pastor has reemerged and he is now out of control. I could barely control my laughter, as I tuned into the Mathews and Olberman shows. As with Osama, these two are now at a complete loss. All had the chance to rid themselves of the pastor, but chose to walk both lines. By doing so, they put themselves in an awkward position which yields no escape route. The pastor is now free to destroy his "brother", while boosting his debut book hype. As Don King would say…."Only in America!".
I was only expecting a split next week, but the pastor has raised my hopes for a Hillary sweep. In a sense, he has brought me inspiration in an indirect kind of way.
It's no wonder the liberals continue to look for any opportunity to defund our troops and exercise surrender. They'll need all the troops back home for the DNC riots.
April 29th, 2008 at 12:41 pm
I can't remember a more interesting turn of events during a presidential race. I hope the pastor stays in it for the long run.
April 29th, 2008 at 3:33 pm
Obama is running away from Wright faster than a speeding bullet now. Obama's new line today was to say 'Rev. Wright is not the person I used to know'. Sure, Barack, sure he isn't. That's the ticket.
Vince, it is a good thing for everyone to see what these america haters are really made of, I guess. The further left a candidate is, the more he will attract these wackadoodles, and Obama is the furthest left of any candidate yet to get this close to the presidency. Obama's criteria for picking Supreme Court justices made me cringe.
larry d, Rev. Wright DID say he'd take the VP job. I'm wondering, if Wright becomes the VP, will that mean that HE'S responsible for the AIDS crisis in Africa ?
Alex, those DNC riots are looking more and more likely, aren't they ? What will the Dems do when one candidate is unelectable (BHO), but leads in elected delegates according to the Dems nutty rules ? What a mess, and the Dems are SO deserving of this. I think we're almost at critical mass, where the liberal media might have to make nice to Hillary after dissing her for the last several months. That should be some interesting kiss up job if they are forced to do it.
April 29th, 2008 at 3:36 pm
It's obvious what's happening here. Creature Wright & Obama Bin Liar are playing the Media. they have gotten together and planned all of this, Wright says things that America will hate and Obama responds with what he believes will Buy Votes. Over & Over this falsely distances Obama from the Bad guy Wright. Good Guy/Bad Guy Game and the Media Is Eating It Up !!!
April 29th, 2008 at 5:08 pm
You might have that fishing paragraph up, but it certianly could be true.
April 30th, 2008 at 12:41 am
Obama… " I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction "
The Winds Have Shifted…
Please Obama, Go stand with Muslims !!!
April 30th, 2008 at 12:52 am
What we are being subjected to by the Power Monger Obama Bin Liar's campaign is a classic Bad Guy / Good Guy Scam…
After being ordered to lay low while a scheme to reverse the negative consequences was devised following the disclosure of his Hateful Anti-American / Anti-White sermons and his long time mentor relationship with the Power Monger Obama Bin Liar, The Hate Monger Wright ( Bad Guy ) has now been coached and is performing per as scripted, Giving speeches containing extremely outrageous comments that have enraged all sane Americans. The Power Monger Obama Bin Liar ( Good Guy ) has also been coached and is performing as scripted, Pretending to condemn and forever distance himself from his mentor the Hate Monger Wright. Sadly, The Media is Eating This Up and is being played like Puppets. Please everyone, Do not be manipulated by this scheme / scam, Do not be fooled into believeing this is anything but a planned and scripted act to devieve voters. Please everyone, Beware Obama Bin Liar !!!
April 30th, 2008 at 7:16 am
King:What will the Dems do when one candidate is unelectable (BHO), but leads in elected delegates according to the Dems nutty rules ?
Even though he's looking pretty unelectable, the far-left has pushed the popular vote/pledged delegate arguement too far and painted themselves in a corner. They may be forced to hand it to Osama, even though they know better. They raised the hype with riot threats, stolen elections, losing the black constituency, and now they're all running scared.
THEY ARE MORE CONCERNED ABOUT LOSING THEIR BREAD AND BUTTER BLACK CONSTITUENTS, RATHER THAN FIELDING A SEMI-ELECTABLE CANDIDATE. Look where social-entitlements have gotten them?
It will be almost like chugging vinegar.
April 30th, 2008 at 7:31 am
Since I am always spam blocked on the Rev's blog and have to jump through hoops to get my every comment on there, I am sending this gift on to you, King:
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20080428_hope_for_corporate_america/
Copy this into your browser and dig in.
It is by Chris Hedges of Truthdig. All the "wishful thinking" concerning what Obama really stands for should dissapate a bit—added to the two "giant egos" of Obama and Wright on center stage—-again, why Hillary has my support.
April 30th, 2008 at 7:50 am
2 cents: I have never, repeat NEVER, blocked any comment. I have not just NOT blocked any of your comments (I welcome them) I have never blocked ANYONE's comment and won't be.
April 30th, 2008 at 8:03 am
King: "If John McCain attended the Rev. David Duke's church for 20 years, and Timothy McVeigh hosted a fundraiser for McCain at McVeigh's house (assuming McVeigh hadn't already taken the down elevator to his special place in hell), would anybody vote for John McCain ?"
Ayers was never convicted of any wrongdoing. Until you prove otherwise, then all you have is accusations. McVeigh was convicted and is…ummm…..now dead, because of his crime. No comparison at all.
Did David Duke pastor an 8000 member church? I missed that. Maybe you could provide a link, you know, to help me understand.
"So, why are people still voting for Barack Obama ?"
Because he's the best candidate for America.
Poor judgment is seen in the destruction and death of 100,000 Iraqi civilians and 4000 American soldiers…..for absolutely no reason or benefit to America. That's what poor judgment looks like…..not picking a church home.
And Obama's words about judge's decision making is spot on. He doesn't say that the Constitution and precedent should not be regarded, as you imply. He is speaking the truth about empathy……something which Republicans and conservatives have no comprehension.
Finally, if the goddamn Democrats are so fraudulent in their voting practices…..why in the hell couldn't Indiana find even ONE case of it in their state? Don't tell me the Democrats are really slick and sly and know how to get away with stuff…..that's the GOP's turf.
April 30th, 2008 at 9:36 am
King it seems you have aroused Rev Red about as much as you ever have. You have him counting the worth of a minister by the number of members in his church. He doesn't, however, mention the $10 million house all those people have paid for so he can retire in style. He failed to mention any of the poor judgement calls from Obama in his need to get at Bush, as he has since December 2000 and goes on and on.
I was more excited to see Red talking about how judges for the Supreme Court should be selected because they are empathetic not because they interpret the Constitution and laws questioned under it with lack of agenda. He sure is one of those of the far left who believes that social agenda should rule over all else. It is too bad that they haven't managed to pack the Court since FDR attempted to get an amendment to allow 15 judges so he could "pack" the court. They always have enough judges there to take advantage of any agenda driven weak moments among some of the other justices.
I agree with you about where those 3 judges must have been coming from. It seems they were the activists that Rev Red so strongly supports. There are about that many who are agenda driven on that Court. It sure is good that Roberts and Alito are there so the travesty Red wanted to occur didn't occur.
April 30th, 2008 at 10:44 am
The Pope has about a billion members in his church. He and Bush had a nice visit the other week. Bush's judgement must be pretty darn good.
April 30th, 2008 at 11:37 am
Italy just elected a conservative, America-friendly prime minister, like France and Germany did last year.
Seems the hate America crowd is centered in 1) the International Left, 2) among Islamofascists, and 3) the Dim Party.
+++
And thanks for the reminder Larry D.
When the pope was here the other week, did he tell Geroge Bush and/or the American people that the Iraq War was unjust?
NO, sir, he sure did not.
I recall some ignoramus posting here insisting that the Vatican declared the Iraq War an unjust war. That was false, and the pope's recent visit attests to its falseness.
If the Vatican thought the Iraq War was an unjust war, the pope would have had the obligation to have brought it up the America.
Lefties left can't get anything straight; they are as crooked as a snake.
April 30th, 2008 at 12:35 pm
***Seems the hate America crowd is centered in 1) the International Left, 2) among Islamofascists, and 3) the Dim Party.***
Ghost, it is very true that the far left is against America but not all Democrats are in the far left part of the Party. The two top Senators for voting left were Obama and Biden in 1907. I guess both of them tried for the Dem nomination this time, too. The best part of this is that the farthest left voter of the two, by less than 2% was Obama. No wonder Rev Red favors Obama over all others. Red does favor anything as long as it is far left and Obama is surely that,
April 30th, 2008 at 12:46 pm
Rev,
I have gone back and forth on this with Jim at Ohio.com for months now—why is it that my comments are always spam-filter blocked on your blog but never on King's blog?
Even corresponded with the main spam filter administrator who came to the conclusion that I was being blocked by some other source—well, What source is it then? I believe that it is not you, but who is it? There are many blogs I cannot post comments to besides this one. It makes me feel censored which makes my blood boil, frankly, as you can imagine. I get tired of having to jump through hoops to get my comments on your blog, and others, too. Makes me think I am being targeted by Bush or Obama camp or somebody, which I think is rather nutty of me.
I understand that it is not you personally blocking me and apparently not he spam filter you are subscribed to, or whatever or however that works. Who or what is it then? it is tiresome and interferes with my freedom of speech which is against my constitutional rights—if I had the funds, I would pursue it.
April 30th, 2008 at 1:30 pm
Everyone, be sure to read 2 cents' link to truthdig. I don't think that any Obama supporter wants to read anything like that but some may learn something there.
While you are there you can view all of Jeremiah (God damn America) Wright and all his speech and Q & A period yesterday. Watch him be a reasonable human being and then become what he became, an arrogant black man, in the Q&A period. Quite a switch he made there.
May 1st, 2008 at 4:54 am
Rev,
You sure dodged my question. You talked in circles around it without addressing it whatsoever, which I take as a tacit admission that you know McCain would be out of the race if he had the same associations as Obama does.
Regarding Ayers, he has ADMITTED BOMBING GOVERNMENT BUILDINGS. He's proud of it. He got off on a technicality. Your defense of him is beyond ludicrous. Are you TRYING to say the absolute dumbest things imaginable ? You must be.
And if you think Obama's social activist requirement for Supreme Court justices is the correct one, then you are woefully lacking in knowledge of the Constitution and the structure of our government. Judges who make up new law destroy our system of checks and balances, usurp the power of the legislative branch, and trump the will of the people (which, of course, is exactly what liberal totalitarians like yourself want). You belong in a different country (I hear Cuba has nice weather).
May 1st, 2008 at 5:11 am
Roy,
I sure haven't been able to find any Constitutional argument against voter id law. The decision on voter id belongs with the legislative branch of government, not the Supremes. I must be reading a different Constitution than our friend, the Rev (I think he's reading the Communist Manifesto by mistake). Rev Red's little red book is not serving him well.
Rev's tirade about David Duke not having an 8000 member church was kind of beside the point, considering my question about McCain was HYPOTHETICAL. And here I thought I was speaking english pretty plainly.
I don't know if I buy completely into the idea that Obama is a corporate-bought politician like it said in 2 cent's article, because too many of his policies are bad for business, but he does play the game like all the rest. That is a fact. He also pays back those who help him. He's been doing that since he first held elective office. Along that vein, guess who got a million dollar earmark from Obama in 2007 ? It was the hospital where Obama's wife works. Now we know why that hospital tripled Michelle Obama's salary when Barack went to the U.S. Senate. It was a legal bribe for a future payoff. Pay to play.
May 1st, 2008 at 1:44 pm
I notice that Da King is hiding from the Reverend's challenge to cite one case of voter ID fraud in Indiana (April 30, 8:03 am). Nobody testifying in the Supreme Court case could cite one either.
The Indiana case was just another Karl Rove strategy to extend "one party rule" over our country.
http://www.slate.com/id/2166589
The Fraudulent Fraud Squad
The incredible, disappearing American Center for Voting Rights.
By Richard L. Hasen
Posted Friday, May 18, 2007, at 1:41 PM ET
Imagine the National Rifle Association's Web site suddenly disappeared, along with all the data and reports the group had ever posted on gun issues. Imagine Planned Parenthood inexplicably closed its doors one day, without comment from its former leaders. The scenarios are unthinkable, given how established these organizations have become. But even if something did happen to the NRA or Planned Parenthood, no doubt other gun or abortion groups would quickly fill the vacuum and push the ideas they'd pushed for years.
Not so for the American Center for Voting Rights, a group that has literally just disappeared as an organization, and for which it seems no replacement group will rise up. With no notice and little comment, ACVR—the only prominent nongovernmental organization claiming that voter fraud is a major problem, a problem warranting strict rules such as voter-ID laws—simply stopped appearing at government panels and conferences. Its Web domain name has suddenly expired, its reports are all gone (except where they have been preserved by its opponents), and its general counsel, Mark "Thor" Hearne, has cleansed his résumé of affiliation with the group. Hearne won't speak to the press about ACVR's demise. No other group has taken up the "voter fraud" mantra.
The death of ACVR says a lot about the Republican strategy of raising voter fraud as a crisis in American elections. Presidential adviser Karl Rove and his allies, who have been ghostbusting illusory dead and fictional voters since the contested 2000 election, apparently mounted a two-pronged attack. One part of that attack, at the heart of the current Justice Department scandals, involved getting the DoJ and various U.S. attorneys in battleground states to vigorously prosecute cases of voter fraud. That prong has failed. After exhaustive effort, the Department of Justice discovered virtually no polling-place voter fraud, and its efforts to fire the U.S. attorneys in battleground states who did not push the voter-fraud line enough has backfired. Even if Attorney General Gonzales declines to resign his position, his reputation has been irreparably damaged.
——————————————————————————–
——————————————————————————–
But the second prong of this attack may have proven more successful. This involved using ACVR to give "think tank" academic cachet to the unproven idea that voter fraud is a major problem in elections. That cachet would be used to support the passage of onerous voter-identification laws that depress turnout among the poor, minorities, and the elderly—groups more likely to vote Democratic. Where the Bush administration may have failed to nail illegal voters, the effort to suppress minority voting has borne more fruit, as more states pass these laws, and courts begin to uphold them in the name of beating back waves of largely imaginary voter fraud.
Perhaps even with the demise of ACVR, the hard work—of giving credibility to a nonproblem—is done. The short organizational history of ACVR, chronicled indefatigably by Brad Friedman of the Brad Blog, shows that the group was founded just days before its representatives testified before a congressional committee hearing on election-administration issues chaired by then-Rep. (and now federal inmate) Bob Ney. The group was headed by Hearne, national election counsel to Bush-Cheney '04, and staffed with other Republican operatives, including Jim Dyke, a former RNC communications director.
Consisting of little more than a post-office box and some staffers who wrote reports and gave helpful quotes about the pervasive problems of voter fraud to the press, the group identified Democratic cities as hot spots for voter fraud, then pushed the line that "election integrity" required making it harder for people to vote. The group issued reports (PDF) on areas in the country of special concern, areas that coincidentally tended to be presidential battleground states. In many of these places, it now appears the White House was pressuring U.S. attorneys to bring more voter-fraud prosecutions.
ACVR's method of argument followed a familiar line, first set out by Wall Street Journal columnist John Fund in his book, Stealing Elections. First, ACVR argued extensively by anecdote, pointing to instances of illegal conduct, such as someone, somewhere registering Mary Poppins to vote. Anecdote would then be coupled with statistics showing problems with voter rolls not being purged to remove voters who had died or moved, leaving open the potential for fraudulent voting at the polls. Finally, the group would claim that the amount of such voter fraud is hard to quantify, because it is after all illegal conduct, hidden from the public. Given this great potential for mischief, and without evidence of actual mischief, allegedly reasonable initiatives such as purging voter rolls and requiring ID seemed the natural solution.
At least in hindsight, the ACVR line of argument is easily deconstructed. First, arguing by anecdote is dangerous business. A new report (PDF) by Lorraine Minnite of Barnard College looks at these anecdotes and shows them to be, for the most part, wholly spurious.* Almost always the allegations were followed by charges being dropped or allegations being unproven (and sometimes raised for apparently political purposes). Sure, one can find a rare case of someone voting in two jurisdictions, but nothing extensive or systematic has been unearthed or documented.
Second, there's no question that there's a fair amount of registration fraud in this country, an artifact of the ability in many states to pay bounty hunters by the head for each new registrant. Some unscrupulous people being paid $3 to $5 for each card turned in will falsify registration information, registering pets or dead people or comic-book characters—none of whom will show up to vote on Election Day (with or without an ID). (I, for one, would turn the whole business of voter registration over to the government and couple a universal voter-registration program with a national voter-ID card paid for by the government—but that's another story.)
Third, and perhaps most importantly, the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible. Suppose I want to swing the Missouri election for my preferred presidential candidate. I would have to figure out who the fake, dead, or missing people on the registration rolls are, and then pay a lot of other individuals to go to the polling place and claim to be Mary Poppins or Old Dead Bob, without any return guarantee—thanks to the secret ballot—that any of them will cast a vote for my preferred candidate. Those who do show up at the polls run the risk of being detected ("You're not my neighbor Bob who passed away last year!") and charged with a felony. And for what—$10? As someone who's thought about this a lot, if I really wanted to buy votes in an enforceable and safe way, I'd find eligible voters who would allow me to watch as they cast their absentee ballots for the candidate of my choice. Then, I would pay them. (Notably, ACVR and supporters of voter-ID laws have generally supported exemptions from ID requirements for voters who use absentee ballots.) Or, I might find an election official to change the votes. Polling-place fraud, in short, makes no sense.
Finally, on the issue of lack of detection: State and local officials have uncovered a fair amount of the absentee-ballot vote-buying I've just described, even though that behavior, too, is illegal and likely hidden from public view. The DoJ devoted unprecedented resources to ferreting out polling-place fraud over five years and appears to have found not a single prosecutable case across the country. The major bipartisan draft fraud report (PDF) (recently posted by Slate and suppressed by the U.S. Election Assistance Commission [TimesSelect subscription required]) concluded that there is very little polling-place fraud in the United States. Of the many experts the commission consulted, the only dissenter from that position was a representative of the now-evaporated ACVR.
Perhaps it is not surprising that ACVR has collapsed as an organization. In what appears to be one of Hearne's last public appearances (where he identifies himself [PDF] as having served—note past tense—as counsel to ACVR) before the EAC in December of 2006, Hearne offered the usual arguments. In support of his position that voter-ID laws did not unconstitutionally suppress the votes of poor and minority voters, Hearne cited the decision of the DoJ to approve the pre-clearance of Georgia's voter-ID law, and a law review article supporting such laws, written under the pseudonym Publius. Hearne didn't reveal that the decision on Georgia was made by political appointees of the DoJ over the strong objections of career attorneys there who believed the law was indeed discriminatory. Nor did he explain that (as I discovered and blogged about a few years earlier) Publius was none other than Hans von Spakovsky, then serving as one of the political DoJ officials who approved the Georgia voter-ID law. (President Bush later gave von Spakovsky a recess appointment to the Federal Election Commission.)
The arguments against vote fraud were built on a house of cards, a house that is collapsing as quickly as the U.S. attorney investigation moves forward.
So Hearne let the organization collapse, and in a bit of irony, a Washington lawyer who bought the ACVR domain name has set it to redirect to the Brennan Center's Truth About Fraud Web site, which debunks ACVR's claims of polling-place voter fraud. But despite the collapse of ACVR, the idea that there is massive polling-place voter fraud has, perhaps irrevocably, entered the public consciousness. It has infected even the Supreme Court's thinking about voter-ID laws. And it has provided intellectual cover for the continued partisan pursuit of voter-ID laws that may suppress minority votes. Just this week, Republican members of the Texas state Senate are trying to push through a voter-ID law over a threatened Democratic filibuster. Their political machinations have already required a Democratic state senator recovering from a liver transplant to show up to vote—and they almost passed the bill when another Democratic senator came down with the stomach flu.
Texas legislators should be ashamed. All of this effort to enact a law that would stop a nonexistent problem. If only there were a way to ensure that spurious claims of polling-place voter fraud could have disappeared with ACVR.
Correction, May 22, 2007: The original version erroneously stated that Minnite was employed at Columbia University. (Return to the corrected sentence.)
May 1st, 2008 at 3:52 pm
From the Dims' point of view, if they can't cheat [have their dead voting, having illegal aliens voting], elections aren't fair.
Now, thanks to the Supreme court, this type of cheating will be harder to do. Poor Dims.
May 1st, 2008 at 6:19 pm
^You're embarassing yourself, Vince. I refuted all that in my post at 1:44 P.M. today.
May 1st, 2008 at 7:10 pm
King
Is Tom here stupid about the realities of big city Dim machine politics or is he just disingenuous like most libs????
May 1st, 2008 at 7:45 pm
I finally figured out who Wright sounds and acts like–Mao.
The only question left is Obama–Chou En Lai
May 1st, 2008 at 9:40 pm
With endorsements won by Obama including Hamas, The black Panthers, Oprah, And Michael Moore… Need we more reasons to Not Vote For Him? Obama is a Threat to National Security!
May 2nd, 2008 at 7:35 am
Tom,
Thank you for your research concerning the un=problem of voter fraud.
I can put it in layman's terms—
Requiring a picture id in order to vote is by far a suppression of American citizens' right to vote–
It is not necessary and is just another "brick in the wall" against our quaint American ideals of trusting our own citizenry.
The erosion of our trust in each other will be our greatest downfall—mark my words here and now.
America will not be recognizable twenty years from now—we will have become what we have fought against for two hundred years. Shame. Shame. Shame.
May 2nd, 2008 at 9:26 am
For 2 Cents & anybody with a heart:
There are people who are of such meager means that they don't own a car. They are largely a population of elderly or disabled people. If you can barely afford to get by, do you think you are going to find your way down to the motor vehicle bureau to buy a driver's license or get a state ID? No. What if you have to move often because you have to follow a job or lose your home due to financial problems? Are you going to fund getting an ID every time you move?
Democratic activists have executed get out the vote efforts to find these people and get them registered and out to the polls. They are Americans; they have a right to vote.
What the Republicans did was to fabricate a false story of fraud by the Democratic activists. (Another campaign of lies by the Republicans–it all seems so commonplace in this century. I digress.) What the Republicans did is very much akin to what the segregationists in the South were doing half a century ago. They made it very difficult for black Americans to vote by demanding a poll tax or a literacy test. This time, they are imposing on disabled and poor people to have to travel somewhere and fund getting an identification card.
We used to be the beacon of hope and democracy. Of course, we should not expect the elitist Republicans to care about the ailing or the poor.
Like Bruce Springsteen said when he was in Cleveland in 2004, I am still going to work to build the America that we hold in our hearts.
—
And for Da King, we are still waiting on your citation of voter fraud in Indiana–me upthread–"I notice that Da King is hiding from the Reverend's challenge to cite one case of voter ID fraud in Indiana (April 30, 8:03 am). "
May 2nd, 2008 at 9:54 am
Tom. Great stuff.
Hades will freeze over before King, or anyone, will provide me with that Indiana voter fraud example.
Like WMD in Iraq, it doesn't exist.
May 2nd, 2008 at 11:31 am
Tom, Rev and all:
I know it is extremely hard for some people to imagine that there actually are people with no cars, or ways to get to a license bureau for a photo id, no less with the thirty or so dollars that it would require—take it from an expert:
there are times when I have nothing—read NO THING, in my pocket that would buy me a gallon of gas to get to a place to get my picture taken so some volunteer at a voting poll can squinch at it to determine that is indeed me.
There are extremely poor among us, and those elders who have a tough time getting up from a chair, let alone out of a car, after begging for some caring soul to come retrieve them, nor can they stand for long in a line to await their turn for a picture id. I know many such people personally, and putting another rock in their way in order to catch some voter phonies that DO NOT EXIST is criminal in intent and cruel in practice. It smacks of discrimination in my book, and I find it reprehensible that this type of hindrance would be put into practice in this country. It is dispicable.
Concern your fake selves with absentee ballots—that is where fraud comes into play—not poor people or elderly or the infirm.
May 2nd, 2008 at 12:35 pm
Obama has no real experience to serve, His political experience is primarly with the Chicago Political Machine, A corrupt group that get very rich disguised as helping the poor blacks while the poor blacks remain forever poor.
May 2nd, 2008 at 2:53 pm
Thanks for the nod, Reverend and 2 cents. Solidarity.
May 3rd, 2008 at 5:32 am
"What the Republicans did is very much akin to what the segregationists in the South were doing half a century ago."
Actually it's what the DIMS in the South were doing half a century ago.
May 3rd, 2008 at 12:02 pm
Knowing Obama is Terrifying !!!
May 3rd, 2008 at 1:08 pm
"Knowing Obama is terrifying!!!"
I don't know.
Hamas seems to know what they see in B. Hussein Obama and like it.
I guess it all depends on your point of view.
May 4th, 2008 at 11:58 am
Mr. Tom,
Thank you for another well written and well researched post. The voter ID charade is just one of the strategems fo the Republicans to suppress the votes of the have nots. As most people know, the real problem is not illegitimate voters, it is voter disenfranchisement. It is what caused the Florida vote in 2000 to be stolen.
Is Mr. Ghost stupid to the realities of spam posts? He likes to respond to them.
May 5th, 2008 at 9:27 am
***It is what caused the Florida vote in 2000 to be stolen.***
I know a spam post when I see one, Frank and that little bit of yours is pure spam. It was proven by the al Times of New York and a number of other "reputable" newspapers that that election was not stolen and that there was actually very little disenfranchisement taking place. The Democrats tried very hard to steal the Florida vote and we were saved by the embarrassment that would have caused by those people who counted over and over in the ensuing months.
I would like to ask the people who speak disenfranchisement by ID laws if the Dems couldn't do the same thing for these old and poor people to get them ID cards that they supposedly did for them to get them registered. I keep wondering why, if they can go somewhere to get registered they couldn't make one more trip to get a picture taken. If they can get out to vote why can't they get out for a picture? Who said it had to be a driver license? Other ID cards have been suggested and, in fact, made easy to get.
No matter how we look at it the Dems thought they had really accomplished something with their big voter registration drives but they don't want to see any of those gains lessened by making people use picture IDs. BTW, wasn't it those same Dems who were keeping blacks and other poor people from voting in the 40s and 50s? Why I believe it surely was those same people in the South.
May 5th, 2008 at 9:34 am
It might be good for those old codgers to get out of the house for an afternoon while their getting their picture i.d.s. They might even be able to reconnect with a younger relative.
This requirement shows real promise in bringing people together.
May 5th, 2008 at 10:43 am
Until the recent Supreme Court ruling, the Dims acted as if they had a constitutional right to cheat in elections.
You see, to the twisted Dim mind, liying & cheating on their part is alright because it's for what they think is the greater good — socialism. WRONG!
May 5th, 2008 at 5:17 pm
Mr. Roysoldboy,
That study by the Times has long been disputed. Thousands of eligible voters were scrubbed by the rolls by being falsely accused of being felons by ChoicePoint, a company with ties to the Republican party. It is only in your parallel universe that the Democrats tried to steal the Florida vote.
A spam post is one which floods the various blogs like this that are sent by campaign staff.
May 5th, 2008 at 5:35 pm
Mr. Ghost,
If you want to know about cheating in elections, look to 1968 when the Republicans had Anna Chenault convince the South Vietnamese to reject a proposed peace deal. About 30,000 Americans died because of this treason. Or, how about the 1980 election in which Republicans convinced the Iranians to hold on to the hostages by promising them arms to fight the Iraqis whom we were also supporting, another example of treason. Or, how about the Republican use of caging lists. Although past abuses have merited the Republicans an injunction against this method, they still persist. What they do is to send nonforwardable letters to minorities who are away at school or in the military overseas to their home address. When they are returned, the Republicans use the returned letter to claim that their absentee ballots are invalid.
So, your allegations are as usual without substance except in your own twisted mind. If anything, the group that believes that the end justifies the means is the Republicans. The Democrats have been the Washington Nationals to the Republicans Globetrotters.
May 6th, 2008 at 5:50 am
Treason is the forte of the Dims. Fact.
As to elections, they will lie and cheat to win political power because they are so amoral that, to them, the ends (their socialistic Utopia) justify such means. Fact.
The question is now how will the Dims try to cheat in November? Any suggestions, Frank?
May 7th, 2008 at 12:29 am
Mr. Ghost,
One suggestion——learn to distinguish your twisted opinions from fact.
May 7th, 2008 at 3:53 pm
I give you the facts, Frank. Unfortunately, you're just aren't man enough to handle them.
Dims lie & cheat in elections, especially in the urban centers. If you don't know this basic fact of political life, you're really too stupid to be allowed outside on your own. Say, who votes for you, anyway, your union?
May 8th, 2008 at 12:56 am
Mr. Ghost,
Really, Chief. You've got to get a handle on this anger thing. But bravo on being able to challenge my masculinity, intelligence, and intellectual independence in so few words.
Since we are being so personal I will let you know that a week ago I got notice that the plant I've worked at for nearly 20 years will close in August. So, I get to start all over at nearly 60. Are you man enough to handle that?
May 13th, 2008 at 7:25 am
Frank,
Thanks for explaining "caging". http://www.ohiomm.com/blogs/da_kings_men/2008/04/29/tuesday-political-stuff/#comment-3134
And good luck on the job hunt.
Tom
May 14th, 2008 at 8:40 pm
Frank,
Stop bellyaching. Everybody has ups and downs in their career. I did, but I never boo-hooed about it on the Internet or anywhere else.
And more to the point, irrespective of your employment situation, the Dims have this propensity to lie and cheat in elections at all levels. Your wishing that this wasn't so does not change the reality.
One reason the Dims cheat is because, since the Dims are the party of big government, they seem to feel they have a natural right to be in control of government. So in their mind, anything they do to win elections is right and just. Again, that is just in "their minds."
As for your employment prospects, they will be greatly diminished if either Comrade Hillary or B. Hussein Obama get elected and implement their tax hiking programs [that is, unless you're planning to get a government job; the Dims will always grow them].
Leftist policies of 'soaking the rich' are counter-productive for the economy. They curtail job creation and hurt the economy.
Here's the equation. Capitalism creates wealth while socialism steals from capitalism and creates misery, shortages, and grief.
So play it smart, Frank. Vote the Republican line in November.
May 16th, 2008 at 3:21 pm
Mr. Ghost,
Thanks for your concern. I should have also included that the plant manager told us that the plant's machinery is being shipped to India where "they have a growing middle class".
I notice that you rarely cite facts to substantiate your inane opinions. Wishing that Ms. Clinton were a communist or that Mr. Obama were a Muslim doesn't make it so except in that Dim bulb of yours. If you think that the Dems outcheat the Rips (as in ripoff), you haven't been paying attention. I have noted several, to name a few, of the treasonous methods that the Rips have used to cheat in presidential elections. Since you believe that the Rips are the party of small government and sound financial policies, perhaps you can cite a Rip administration which has made either happen.
When we "soaked the rich", we led the industrialized nations in categories such infant mortality, levels of education, disposable income, etc. Where do we rank now? What was your portion of government debt, then and now? Do you really want to brag about job creation in these times of low taxation on the wealthy?
Look, Chief, over the last forty years, we've had conservative Dems and fascist Rips as presidents. Even you cannot be so stupid as to deny the decline in this country. You choose to blame those who haven't been in power. You give no one facts, Chief. All you give is regurgitated talking points from the very people who screw you over.
I will play it smart, Chief. I haven't bought the Rip line for over thirty years and won't in November.
May 16th, 2008 at 3:29 pm
Tom,
Thanks for your wish of luck in my job search.
For more details on electoral cheating by Republicans, I would suggest reading Greg Palast.
May 17th, 2008 at 8:32 am
I read a comment from Tom over on the Rev's blog today that made me revisit this thread. Evidently the anti-voter id crowd has had the run of the place.
First, to those of you complaining about the disabled, the elderly, and the poor without a car, how are those people going to the polls to vote in the first place ? I'm afraid I don't know any people who don't have some form of id, which, btw, are FREE in Indiana.
Second, regarding evidence of voter id fraud in Indiana, it is beside the point anyway, but if you folks want to think Indiana is the only state in the country where voter fraud never occurs, go right ahead, but it's a disingenuous argument. The idea of voter id is to PREVENT vote fraud through false voter registrations. Since people aren't required to produce id when they vote, how can voter fraud even be proven ? It could be rampant in Indiana and we'd never know it, because it's a snap to pull it off without some form of verification.
But if you want some examples of Indiana voter fraud, here are some:
http://www.kpcnews.com/articles/2008/01/09/news/today/evening_star/doc478441f2313a5420740819.txt
http://www.thetimesonline.com/articles/2006/12/31/news/top_news/a3920b428e23380086257255000b14e6.txt
May 17th, 2008 at 8:54 am
A comment by Tom over on the Rev's blog today made me revisit this site. It seems the anti-voter id folks have had the run of the place.
For all those alleged poor folks who can't afford an Id, the Id's in Indiana are free. Are there really lots of folks running around without a valid form of identification ? I don't think so. Sounds like a red herring argument to me.
For all the elderly and disabled people (every one of whom I've ever known HAS had an Id, it's essential for them), if they can't get around to get an Id, how are they getting around to the polls ? There is still a means to submit an absentee ballot under voter id law. Red herring number two dispatched.
For the disingenuous argument promoted here that there is no voter fraud in Indiana, I say, how the heck would you know if there was voter fraud or not in Indiana, since voter fraud is the easiest thing in the world to pull off WITHOUT SOME MEANS OF IDENTIFYING THE VOTERS !!! It could be rampant and we wouldn't know, or it could be rare, it doesn't matter, the point is, voter Id IS THE MEANS TO PREVENT IT. I'm glad our banks don't have the same loose rules regarding Id as the anti-voter id folks here do regarding voting, or banks would be getting ripped off left and right. Maybe Indiana is the only state in the union where all the voters are too honest and upstanding to engage in vote fraud, but I kinda doubt it.
I'm also pretty sure voter id doesn't apply only to Democrats. It applies to Republicans as well, but somehow Republican voters aren't finding the law too restrictive. Imagine that.
You anti-id'ers might want to check out this site, which discusses how woefully outdated the Indiana voter rolls are:
http://www.bbvforums.org/cgi-bin/forums/board-auth.cgi?file=/1954/73758.html
May 17th, 2008 at 8:57 am
I almost forgot, you asked for instances of voter fraud in Indiana. You can start with this site:
http://www.gop.com/Indiana.htm