13 fed on Thanksgiving Day, 23 on Saturday. That's the very local Reverend household news. Early reports indicate leftovers will last approximately 6.375 days. Now onto the world scene…..
My last post mentioned the release of new Condi Rice related 9-11 program activities…..and I introduced it by pointing out how embarassing or bad news is often released strategically on a Friday night or, in this case, a holiday, to minimize it's impact.
From the Thanksgiving Day NY Times….
The Roman Catholic Church and the police in Ireland systematically colluded in covering up decades of child sex abuse by priests in Dublin, according to a scathing report released Thursday.
Reread that sentence to, you know, fully appreciate the moral leadership and example-setting of the Roman Catholic Church's hierarchy. Take special note of the word "decades."
Recently, I wrote a blog comparing the American Bishop Tobin's use of "Catholicism first, country second"…..to criticism of Major Hasan, the Ft. Hood shooter. Criticism which suggested Hasan put "Islam first" and "America second", and that that was unacceptable.
In the comment stream of that post I (wrongly) used some pretty rough language to describe how I felt about Catholic Church leadership. This leadership….
The cover-ups spanned the tenures of four Dublin archbishops and continued through to the mid-1990s and beyond, even after the church was beginning to admit to its failings and had professed that it was confronting abuse by its priests.
What were the priorities here of god's great and moral representatives on earth? Surely, the mediators of god's direct grace to fallen and sinful man, the keeper of the keys to god's eternal kingdom of love and peace…responded properly when they found out about this…..I mean, right?
Sadly, no…..
"…rather than helping the victims, the church was concerned only with “the maintenance of secrecy, the avoidance of scandal, the protection of the reputation of the church, and the preservation of its assets,” said the 700-page report,…"
Jesus wept. All Catholics should also.
If you're taking notes….jot down "preservation of its assets". High muckedy-mucks of "faith" are often deferred to as "servants of god", "holy men", and the like. They conduct very solemn and Serious hocus-pocus ceremonies where pew-sitters are put in awe by the "Mysteries of God". But when the nonsense and the window dressing is stripped away and seen for what it is….it's really all about the "preservation of (the) assets." Commit that phrase to memory.
At this point it's time for me to ask the question: Would contributing to the worldwide Catholic Church be the same as contributing to a known terrorist organization? Just asking.
Just in case readers might think that this Dublin report is a hit-piece report by some hellbound atheist group bent on taking down the cosmic and eternal kingdom led by god's only Vicar on earth….think again….
…the 700-page report, (was) prepared by a group appointed by the Irish government and called the Commission of Investigation Into the Catholic Archdiocese of Dublin.
I think readers should remember all of this the next time some American bloviator on the teevee speaks approvingly of the "grand Irish Catholic tradition."
Maybe this report is a one-off, an outlier, a fluke, and really doesn't represent the admirable and to-be-imitated goodness of the divinely ordained Catholic Church…..
The report is the latest in a series of damning revelations about the church. In May, a report chronicled the sexual, emotional and physical abuse of orphans and foster children over 60 years in a network of church-run residential schools meant to care for the vulnerable and the disadvantaged.
Here's a special little tidbit from the NYT piece for those who recoil from reading vulgar language….
The report details examples of priests who were blatant, notorious abusers, but who were allowed to continue without punishment or censure. One priest admitted to abusing more than 100 children. Another said he had abused, on average, a child every two weeks for 25 years.
Got vulgarity?
Puts an entire new meaning on the words of Jesus…"Suffer the little children to come unto me"….doesn't it?
And to think that those filthy scum priests were prohibited by Church Doctrine from defiling their mediation of god's grace to the unwashed and sinful masses…by marrying.
The Reverend is an outspoken atheist. I've paid my dues when it comes to religion. I can confidently share my unfaith with anyone who doesn't have a closed mind. I am unafraid.
However, if there were a god, if there were a hell where some vengeful, sado-masochistic god kept a human's "spirit" in some eternal torment……there would be a helluva big group of Roman Catholic Church leaders smoldering away.
Religion poisons everything. Religious leaders do the poisoning.
{ 21 comments… read them below or add one }
I agree that the covering up of sexual abuse by Catholic priests was disgraceful, and definitely should be condemned. No question about that.
But, as usual, you go too far by asking, "Would contributing to the worldwide Catholic Church be the same as contributing to a known terrorist organization?" and then by making the blanket statement that "religion poisons everything."
I don't know about contributing to "the worldwide Catholic church." Most parishioners contribute to their parish, so it can stay up and running, which many can no longer afford to do. I grew up in the Catholic church. I went to Catholic school. I was never abused, and I never heard of anyone who was abused or any abusive priests in our parish, to this day. So, were WE comparable to terrorists ? Did WE poison everything ? The answer to that is an unqualified NO. I got a superior education in Catholic school. When I finally started going to public schools when I was older, I found that my educational level was years ahead of that of the public school students. Thank you, Catholic school. Thank you, Catholic church. You gave me a great start in life. The church and school I grew up in is closed, and that is a detriment to our community. The church did a lot for the poor. It ran soup kitchens that will no longer be there. It provided clothing that will no longer be there. It provided toys for children on Christmas, turkeys on Thanksgiving. That's in addition to the moral and spiritual leadership. It was pretty much the polar opposite of "poison," Rev.
And again I say Marxism is a religion, and poisons society.
So why do you support Marxism in all its facets?
Jeff,
You probably already know this, so I'll say it for the Reverend's benefit – Marxism is one of the most poisonous religions there is. It's God is the omnipotent state. Think of every omnipotent state in human history……….then try to name a GOOD one. It can't be done, because man is not equipped to play God. Man is too flawed. Freedom is the best and only way.
Slow news day so we'll demonize the Christians. Even though we still defend the muslem terrorists?
Could this be considered a reason for not allowing gays to adopt children, especialy little boys?
Why is the church aiding and abedding homomsexual crimes against children? Sort of like a religious NAMBLA. hmmmmm.
Of course we would compare this church to muslem terrorists. I'm sure that at one point during their crime they were shouting "oh god, oh god".
I notice famous murderous catholics like the Kennedys never speak out against the gay atrocities. WHy didn't they confront the church? How did they take holy communion from they? Was it because Joe Kenendy gave so much to the chursh that heDoes this make them co-conspirators in this case, afterall Ted was one of the most recognized and powerful people in our govt.. I would think so. If I found out that my pastor was fondling kids or cheating was an alcoholic or was shouting racial slurs, I would absolutley leave. How could they feed my spiritual side if they were lying, adulterous, racists? That's why my faith is pretty much "go it alone, with a side of community outreach and service."
Rev without the Christian church and spirit in America we would be like Russia. Hollow shells of miserable, self loathing pieces of human flesh. Catholics and Christians parishoners are the most giving people in the country and the world. Follwing the principles of Christ is why CHristian groups are the first to arrive on any scene where help is needed. We had medical and essential supply trucks in place even before Katrina hit. Dumbass Ray Nagen couldnt even get someone to get his own people out, with buses owned by his city and the state. The problem with the church is the same with our left side government. The people pay and pay, they do all the work and the leaders motivate them by distributing contorted truths and sending a big dose of fear and guilt and a nice portion of "do as I say not as I do" as evidenced by the gay and adulterous politicians that lead our communities. When did becoming a man of god come with stock options, limosines, planes and huge salaries and concubines? Sounds like the preachers are in cahoots with the political leadership. Because no matter whether they, politicians or political leaders, fondle kids, ask for sex by signaling under a restroom door or promise sex for drugs from a gay limo driver it is all wrong and these people aren't fit to be leading our country. Their minds are clouded with the spirit of Caligula.
As far as the Catholic education..King is right on the money. The reason? They teach so that the children learn the basics and they prepare them for their future and higher education. Our public school system, ran by liberals and labor unions, has become a source of lemming building and reinforcing a far left "anything goes" political platform and endorses a liberal revisionist ideal of recreating and demonizing American history and it's forefathers to further that agenda. The 60'/70's college mantra of America "bad" Russia "good". god "bad" humanism "good". is the basis of this agenda. Yet look who is getting filthy rich…those kids that hated capitalism and govt in the 60's and 70's the difference from then and now.. they joined the ranks of the bourgois. Now we are living the beginning of communism and the end days of rome simultaniously.
I wonder if they ever compared the test scores of US Catholic and Christian schools to others around the world.
Why do we consider marxism a religion? It's a nickname for a type of government.
Like most things you miss the point.
It is not that you don't have faith. You have a mis-placed faith.
You have placed your faith in man.
Christians and Catholics alike think child molesters are monsters. Accessories to molestation are at least as bad. Anger should be directed at the acts and those that committed the acts, not God that they were pretending to work for when they committed these acts. Men are fallible.
On the other hand, one of your core beliefs took a big hit recently. You have not even brought it up.
The emails and files from the Climate Research Unit, being called Climategate. You trusted these people. You placed your faith in these men.
Now we know that they privately admitted there were flaws in their public statements. They admitted to using tricks to hide temperature declines. They discussed the idea on changing the definition of peer review so that they wont have their theories reviewed by a critical mind. Deleting emails, destroying real temperature data.
This is the stuff that should shake your faith.
I can't even think of a good analogy, it's almost as if God came out to tell people he didn't exist.
Is any person, or institution made up of people, 100% good or bad? Of course not. I always segregate the religious leaders and the religious doctrines from the pew sitters when I criticize religion. Those who read here know that.
I've encountered some of the nicest human beings through and in religion…..AND….I've encountered some of the worst.
bzzzp…."Like most things you miss the point.
It is not that you don't have faith. You have a mis-placed faith.
You have placed your faith in man."
Please believe me when I say…."I've paid my dues when it comes to religion. I can confidently share my unfaith with anyone who doesn't have a closed mind. I am unafraid."
Faith, the Bible says, is "the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things unseen."
That's fantasy talk.
Mankind is simply another one of the life forms on planet earth. Mankind has no purpose, or reason for being. We are. Our end is death. Every human who has ever lived, or will ever live in the future, will die. Does that sound like a person who places his faith in humankind?
Every advancement in humankind's existence has come from humans, themselves. Liberal man has, over time, civilized human kind somewhat. Humans have discovered and advanced technology, and I'm thankful our wars are smaller. But make no mistake…..there's no end game to place your faith in.
There has never been any intervention in humankind's existence by some invisible creature-god. The future of mankind is extremely bleak. We, one day, will become extinct on earth. Homo sapiens will be no more. Nothing will save us. It's not a matter of if, it's only a matter of when. Dark enough for ya' yet, or shall I go on?
PS….this…"one of your core beliefs"…is misguided. Search the archives. I stay mostly away from the global warming "argument." What IS one of my core beliefs is accepting science over religious or political ideology.
I apologize if I put words in your mouth, I should have said one of your sides core beliefs. But as it turns out it wasn't science it was fraud.
I can appreciate that you had a bad experience with religion. I am sorry to hear that.
I, on the other hand, can confidently share my faith with anyone who doesn't have a closed mind. I am unafraid.
I remember hearing that 1000 monkeys with typewriters would eventually duplicate all of the great works of literature. I look at this as an analog of how people without faith view the world. Correct me if I am wrong. They could not and would not duplicate all of the great literature.
I cannot look at the world without thinking that there is, for the lack of a better word, an Eternal Engineer, that designed the system. Animals breathe in oxygen and exhale carbon dioxide. Plants take in carbon dioxide and release oxygen. It is a great system.
Everything gets smaller and more dense when it gets colder, even water. Except when it turns to ice. It becomes less dense and gets larger. If this wasn't the case, all living things would die.
I am really not trying to get under your skin (this time at least).
I have both sides covered. I am happy and I have faith. Even if it turns out that I am wrong about God, I will still have lived a happy life. It is a win/win.
You don't seem to have either side covered. You seem pretty angry. For instance, your name is chosen just to mock people. If you are not happy and you don't have your butt covered in the afterlife, what have you won?
I realize this isn't exactly the right place to debate religion. Can you access my email from my profile? I would be glad to share my views and listen to yours. I haven't always had a strong faith. I had religion shoved down my throat as a child and I resented it.
** I can't completely let you of the hook with the politics. What is your belief that the government will do a better job of running health-care, if not "the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things unseen."
I am pretty much like the Reverend. Except I have never been a part of any religion. I do, however, have the same mistrust in being lead by the principles of others, untested and untried. I trust the information and 'guidance' of the scientific method, because it asks, even requires, that a person be completely skeptical, yet completely open-minded.
And if the Reverend seems angry, well, I am angry also. Atheists/Agnostics often are. How else could you feel about a world in which organized groups constantly ask you to trust, and, having gained that trust, betray it? Think, open-mindedly, for just a minute, I ask. Every one of the children whose faith led to one of the most severe betrayals there is, how much anger do they have? I'm not saying every atheist was abused by a priest, of course. But most have had their trust abused or betrayed somewhere along the line, and decided to have 'faith' only in things that ask for none.
Ahh…slamming Catholics. Cutting edge. And original.
Hey, are you going to address the "climate change" fraud thing? Billions of dollars down the UN rathole, it seems.
Or how about more on Obama's escalation of the war? He's making a speech tonight, you know. Surely that comes as a huuuge disappointment to you and others who would rather America lose wars.
Jacquie is on to something. It strikes me that many vocal atheists such as the Reverend have constructed their philosophy out of bitter anger rather than rational thought. They're just as delusional as the religious nuts they hate so much, really.
You lie…did you miss my "Wrong on Afghanistan" post?
Reporting on how an organized church hierarchy covered up for dozens and dozens of monster employees who abused children is…..wait for it…."bashing Catholics?" Please.
bzzzp….we'll get back to this material again later…I promise. Just one note. I didn't have a bad experience with religion….I systematically unpacked religion one layer at a time, and found that the suitcase carried nothing of value. It was quite an experience, but not a bad one….and the further away I get from religion, the more certain I am that my unpacking was done accurately, fairly and according to the available facts. When I began my journey through religion, I had no expectations that I would be throwing it all in the dumpster before I was through. It even came as a surprise to me. More later.
Rev,
You have written many posts bashing Catholics. It seems to be almost an obsession with you. I don't see you writing posts bashing other specific religions, though you do bash Israel. I assume that is not religion-based.
As for religion/spirituality, people are entitled to their own beliefs. I don't care, as long as your religious belief/non-belief doesn't trample on mine. It's a free country. If you can look at all the astounding complexity of creation, the mind-boggling odds against the very possibility of our existence, and then determine that it's all meaningless and random, so be it. I couldn't disagree more, but everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
I also have to agree with larry about what Jacquie said. Anger at particular persons or institutions is a very poor basis on which to base your beliefs. People always haven been, and always will be fallible, thus institutions erected by people are also fallible. The life of Jesus serves as a very good testament to that.
Rev says, "I systematically unpacked religion one layer at a time, and found that the suitcase carried nothing of value"
I'm not in any organized church these days, but I'm a little surprised that you would say there is "nothing of value" there, even being an atheist. Is there nothing of value in the words and life of Jesus Christ ? I find tons of value there, lots of insight into humanity, and truly revolutionary words being spoken that have impacted western civilization immensely to this day, 2000 years later. I'd also say it's no coincidence that western civilization advanced the quickest, being rooted in the Judeo-Christian ethic. In fact, lots of what liberals claim they stand for comes from the words of Jesus – helping the poor, non-violence, equal rights, etc.
Nothing that Jesus said or taught was new. Many religions preceding Jesus taught the same things, including Judaism.
"..it's no coincidence that western civilization advanced the quickest, being rooted in the Judeo-Christian ethic.."
Of course that cuts both ways. The Dark Ages, quite a long stretch, came about BECAUSE of Christianity.
What liberals claim they stand for would be identical if Jesus never existed.
And to those who mistakenly throw up the "anger" bullsh*t….
First…Jacquie said this…." well, I am angry also." How in the hell, then, is she saying anything different from me? She's not….I know her….she's a good one.
Second….if the Irish Catholic molesters and their co-conspirators' story doesn't anger you…then you are beyond hope. Seriously. EVERYONE should be outraged.
Third…."It strikes me that many vocal atheists such as the Reverend have constructed their philosophy out of bitter anger rather than rational thought. They're just as delusional as the religious nuts they hate so much, really."
REALLY? I mean, really? Pointing out that a conspiracy to cover up a massive rape of children operation by church employees is abhorrent….is not "rational?"
What would be rational? Wouldn't it be "delusional" if someone criticized the criticism of such vulgar behavior?
Finally….I've made myself perfectly clear on this material. Just as I don't criticize folks who buy health insurance but instead the for-profit hellions who sell it…..so too Catholicism. And my goodness…..who in their right mind could defend such an obviously corrupt and unworthy outfit as the Catholic Church has proven itself to be? When evil makes itself known, just as the neo-con hero, W., used to say…..you are either on the side of the evil or you are against it.
The folks who implicate all of Islam with the actions of a few extremist nuts are the same folks who refuse to blame Catholicism for it's systemic involvement in some of the worst crimes against children ever recorded. That only makes sense if those folks are "delusionally" biased.
My issue with you was over your "nothing of value" statement about religion. You didn't say anything to disprove me. You talked around my statement instead of addressing it directly.
As for saying Jesus' words were advocated by Judaism (Old Testament), I'm again surprised that a former Reverend like yourself would say such a thing. All you have to do is read the Old Testament vs. the New Testament to see the difference. It's immense, and Jesus was the difference. The Old Testament is 'fight your enemies and fear a vengeful God.' The New Testament is 'love your neighbor,' and 'let he who is without sin cast the first stone.' Nothing of value ? Hardly.
I've known a lot of Catholics and none of them are nearly as sanctimonious as you, Reverend.
I've known a lot of wingnuts, larry,….and setting sanctimony aside….they're pretty much all equally clueless.
That's not really setting sanctimony aside, Reverend.
Maybe not for you.
If it's true…and it is….that blind pigs find the occasional acorn….then it is also true that any organization of people can stumble upon a righteous action or thought once in a while….even though the trend of that organization is normally destructive. Nazis, obviously, had an evil trend going on…but I'm sure they did the occasional 'good' thing.
King….your comprehension of Jesus in relationship to Old Testament Judaism needs a bit of work. Love god, love the neighbor. That's Christianity….that's also shorthand for the 10 Commandments.
Forgiveness was encouraged by the O.T. law….and was depicted regularly in Temple rituals. Jesus preached to Jews. Jesus taught his parables to Jews. He was not ecumenicallly minded, his loyalty was to Judaism. Perhaps you missed Matthew 25, and the book of Revelation…where the loving, peaceful, forgiving Jesus returns to kill and destroy the work of unbelievers.
The New Testament writings are from a smallish sect of Jews who were followers of a radical teacher. The Gospels were primarily circulated to combat the teaching of pharisaical Judaism about the fledgling group. Much of the New Testament has to do with early church organization, rules and regulations, etc. The entire 1st century ordeal was an inter-tribal battle among Jews…..a religious schism of small proportions.
Yes, later when Rome adapted the new "hero worship" religion to fit the state, Christianity became widespread…but by then, it had been twisted and distorted beyond any credible recognition…..like it remains today.
No value in "forgiveness," being "peaceful," or "loving thy neighbor", Rev ? None ? You're proving my point for me. I appreciate it.
And your attempt to turn Jesus into a Nazi isn't very persuasive either. Jesus never invaded Poland.